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Kgs11's picture
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Is it Ever OK to consider buying a pup from a backyard breeder? We found a Dobie pup. Shots up to date, parents on site, health records in place. CKC registered. Ears not cropped yet at 9 weeks. Is that a big deal? We're not going to breed or place our Dobie in competitions. We just want a loving pet for our home. Thanks.

Lady Kate's picture
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Can + Worms = Do Not Open!!!!

chris b.'s picture
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Well said Kate, where is that "like " button?

cynfully2's picture
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LOL, well said Kate!

The vast majority of dogs dumped at shelters and rescues come from people who just wanted to have a litter - 25% of all dogs dumped at shelters are purebred.  Do you really want to support that?

This is a breed with serious health issues - you want to try and stack the deck in your favor!  If you don't really care where your dog comes from - then rescue.  JMHO

Enzo's Mom's picture
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@ Fitzmar - well said! Since we lost our last rescue to a liver disorder at 6yo, we decided to find a good breeder and we really checked out health, temperment and the parent's pedigree. Enzo has turned out to be an awesome 4.5 month boy! Doing great with probiotic (thank you for the suggestion) and now doing incredible with all the socialization I have been doing!  Cheers ~

NINKOjIN's picture
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This place wouldn't happen to be in Texas, would it? I have a bad story about a BYB there.

Either way, don't do it.

Rescue if you can't/don't want to pay for a quality breeder's puppy. Just the other day I got an email from a rescue site where I had previously placed a search for a dobie puppy before I got my boy, and they found a dobie puppy in a shelter in my state a few weeks later. Purebred, cheap, all shots and health checked, fixed, everything. If I hadn't have gotten by boy earlier, I would have gotten that shelter pup!

Sheebaroo's picture
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 We found a Dobie pup. Shots up to date, parents on site, health records in place. CKC registered.

Raises hand with a ??? What happin's to the afore mentioned pup ? I'm all for rescue dogs as my family has rescued a Dobe that was tied to a phone pole with a bag of food beside him.

But what happins to that pup ? If it dose not sell, which in all likely hood it will, dose it end up being bred, end up in a rescue, maybe some here would rather you wait for that pup to end up in a rescue or shelter, then go get it from there. It's a dog and if it has a chance to end up in a good loving home i'm all for that. 

 

 

 

NINKOjIN's picture
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The problem with that, Sheebaroo, is by purchasing a puppy from a bad breeder, you are supporting that bad breeder to continue breeding for more money. If everyone stopped buying their puppies, they would have to stop breeding as there would be no profit in it, and then countless future puppies from that breeder wont have to be born and wind up in bad situations because of them. There are plenty of puppies that need homes that have already been rescued and are simply awaiting adoption, and their original breeders (most likely bad) wont make any profit off those.

I was of the same mindset as you when I first started looking for puppies, so I can understand where you are coming from. I figured "it's cheap, and it'll wind up in a bad home anyway, I should rescue it myself and give it a good life" but then I really thought about what that meant down the road. Supporting these people is no good. At least in my mind.

I would either pay what a good puppy from a reputable breeder is worth, be on a waiting list, or search for a rescued puppy/dog if I couldn't afford one from a quality breeder.

And honestly with what vet bills, cropping (if you want it done) and other things cost, you might as well fork over the bucks for the good puppy. Paying cheap in the long run could equal HUGE bills for disease and illness care that could have otherwise been avoided by getting a truly healthy puppy.

KevinK's picture
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Sheebaroo, while I can understand that logic, it's not the way it works.  When you support these breeders, you are doing more damage than good.  By saving that 1 dogs life, you are not giving the breeder his money for the next litter, and the cycle continues.  So, I don't look at it as saving a life, I look at it as funding future breeding, and making the situation much worse.  I'm all for saving animals, but do it through a reputable rescue or shelter.  At least the money you give them goes to save other dogs, as opposed to funding more unethical breedings.

Sheebaroo's picture
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But Kevin, what some are doing on these forums is basicly robbing that pup of a possible good home, and dogs deserve better than that. I just refuse to give in on this issue, all dogs are great and they all deserve good homes, no matter where they come from.

Sheebaroo's picture
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What happin's to the afore mentioned pup ?

NINKOjIN, what happins to this pup then ? Thats really all i'm asking, if this person who is taking the time to come here and ask about it, clearly they care some what for it already, if they go get a rescue pup thats great, but what about the pup they are asking about now ? What happins to it ?

KevinK's picture
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You have to look at the big picture, not the small picture.  Thousands of dogs are killed every single day, because unethical breeders give dogs to anyone with a checkbook, whether or not they are actually able to care for a dog.

What would a good breeder do that had an "extra" pup?  They would give it a warm, loving, caring home, and not thing twice about it.  They wouldn't dump it in a shelter because it's cutting into profits.  Just like they would take any dog back, at any time, for any reason, and do the same to make sure they had a good life.  If they can't re-home, they keep the dog.  They don't dump them if they don't sell.

Don't get me wrong, I FULLY agree that EVERY dog deserves a good home.  But there's no way to dispute that if you give money to unethical breeders, you are hurting the dogs more than you are helping.

If you truly want to save a life, then go to your local rescue or kill shelter, and save a dog that is about to be killed.  The odds are extremely high these dogs are from byb's so you're getting the same dog, and you are not supporting unethical breedings.  

Sheebaroo's picture
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I'm gonna break this down for ya Kevin, stay with me here.

You have to look at the big picture, not the small picture.

I am looking at the big picture, the dogs are the big picture.

Thousands of dogs are killed every single day, because unethical breeders give dogs to anyone with a checkbook, whether or not they are actually able to care for a dog.

This will not change ever, even with what i will say later on in this post, bad humans will always be on this earth, and some --- no matter what will get to have a dog with or without having cash. Its not the dogs fault they are like they are and i will never look at it any other way.

What would a good breeder do that had an "extra" pup? They would give it a warm, loving, caring home, and not thing twice about it. They wouldn't dump it in a shelter because it's cutting into profits.

So theres two scenerios there, which one dose the afore mentioned pup fall into ? One it has a good breeder and its ok for the OP to go on and get this pup, or the this pup gets dumped at the shelter, see my issue now ?

Don't get me wrong, I FULLY agree that EVERY dog deserves a good home.

Agreed, so is best not to rob pups, regaurdless it's where from ---- of a good home ? 

But there's no way to dispute that if you give money to unethical breeders, you are hurting the dogs more than you are helping.

And theres no way to dispute that by telling people online not to get a pup because of BYB or whatever, some are robbing that pup of a good home. I want to stop here and repost with a better solution to this whole ordeal, it's being handeld in the wrong manner, its taking good homes from dogs and thats not fair.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sheebaroo's picture
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Sorry OP, you are asking about a pup you want and i'm all for you getting it, if it's truely the pup YOU want and will care for it's entire life. Kevin i will start a new thread on how i think things should be handled, to get where i want, i will need your help in answering a few questions i have. 

KevinK's picture
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no prob, I made a few posts, and your main question was answered before I got there.

jsteen67's picture
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Joined: 2012-11-05

To be honest, the best (longevity and temperament) dogs that we have ever had have been from breeders a step away from those who show their dogs and push for champion/AKC titles...at least those titles in front of the name.  We find breeders who are not focused on pure physical traits...a practice that can name an inherintely weak and structurly unsound dog a champion. These breeders are individuals who care about their dogs and are selective of who they breed their female (s) to. They care where the puppies go. Usually these are not puppies that will win conformation classes. However, they tend to be more stabile temerament wise and turn into wonderful, healthy, dogs. The last dog we had, we broke from our tradition and went to a "top breeder".  His parents and lineage on both sides was impressive. His grandmother had won top bitch in the country for his breed. Sadly, he passed away last month at the age of 7. We are planning on getting another puppy this December. The breeder is actually a couple. They care about the health and well being of their dogs and the puppies. Their dogs live in the house and are a part of the family. Many people would describe them as a back yard breeder. I would pick one of these puppies well before I would from a top show breeder.  Yes, there are many irresponsible breeders out there, but I think lumping everyone together as "bad" and "to be avoided" who are not from a top kennel is misleading.

I call the above post as BS!  The Doberman is not a long lived breed and you have to study pedigrees and do the health testing ... but there are no guarantees.  As far as temperament, show dogs don't make it in the show ring if they have bad temperaments!!  I've seen a ton of byb Dobermans with bad temperament and very very few well bred Dobermans with bad temperament.

You don't have to go to a "top" show kennel to get a well bred dog. There are many many breeders out there than only breed every once in awhile - and they pour their heart and soul into every litter they ever produce AND do it all right.... no cutting corners:  no breeding their girl to their male just because it is convenient, no skipping on health testing, proving their dogs in the ring... whether that be the conformation ring or the performance ring... or both.  

People who breed their pets to make more pets are not doing the breed any favors no matter what the above poster may say. 

KevinK's picture
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jsteen, not sure where you're getting your info from...  I wouldn't call a breeder who breeds only for confirmatoin, with no regards to longevitity and/or temperment to be a "good" breeder.  You want the total package, and you want it proven.

tess's picture
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This is a hot bed of a topic. I think I can add to this thread. I know of an older lady in my town that breeds Maltese and poodles. She breeds them for profit. Strickly for profit. She is considered in my book a BYB. She turns out dogs CONSTANTLY. She is known in my town by the animal control as a
"horder'. With that said they do NOTHING and its heartbreaking. She has a basement with cages. Some of her dogs are kennelized. That means that they NEVER see the outside. They get no excercise and are scared. Now she works with a downstate rescue when she gets too many dogs. She is not regulated in any form or fashion and lives outside of the city limits. This is not what you want to support. I have personally re-homed severl of her dogs over the years and that is why I am familiar with her and her set-up. It sickens me and if I could shut her down, I would do it in a heartbeat. Thank God for rescue organizations.  Support the rescue not the breeder.

 

Tess

Lady Kate's picture
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Welcome to the Worms...

seeingRED's picture
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There ARE and HAVE BEEN positive scenarios! !