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Attention Defecit Doberman!
We're having major issues with the pooping outside deal. Gauge is so good about letting us know when it's time to go out to pee, for which i'm grateful because at least with poop, I can pick it up and it doesn't seep into the carpet. When it comes to bowel movements though, he's awful.
We're on a food schedule now. He eats, we go outside 15 minutes after, walk around our potty area for 5-10 minutes and then if we don't go, we come back inside and repeat about 15 minutes later. Rinse. Repeat. Neither AJ or I mind getting up to take him out, but it's like a game to him it seems. He'll stand by the door, and we'll hope that it's a signal that he has to poo. We'll go outside, he'll sniff and then chase bugs, dig a hole, stare off into the distance, contemplate life, etc.
This goes on for the duration, we go back inside and after the 2nd or 3rd cycle, he'll settle down. Then he'll wander, we'll take him out again thinking this is it and he's distracted by a fly. Or a bird. Or a car. Right after we come in for the nth time, he'll lay down. Then he'll get up and sneak away and go poop where we aren't. Literally, within minutes of coming in from the 4th or 5th time outside.
He's got to go outside on a leash as we don't have fencing up yet. Peeing on the leash is not an issue, but I can count on 2 hands the number of times he's actually pooped outside in the past 3 weeks and still have fingers left over.
When he does manage to go outside, he's praised and given treats and good boys and we basically throw a parade for him. Then he forgets and 2 hours later, he's doing it in the kitchen or office or bedroom.
Grrrrr.
Sounds your pup has turned the tables... He has trained YOU how to take him outside!! Funny, these smart lil buggers!! I would stop that immediately, don't let him dictate when you take him out.
The best way to avoid developing a bad habit is to never let it happen. That's why I am such a huge advocate of ALWAYS watching your puppy when he's out of his crate. During potty training and the beginning stages, if a dog goes in the house, I call it MY fault. I need to adjust my schedule, spend more time outside, and keep a better eye on my dog. You say he "sneaks away", and for a variety of reasons, don't let that happen.
If it's around the time he has to poop, take him out, and stay out till he goes. Make a big deal out of it, but don't go back in the house. You don't want your pup to think that going poop means the end of playtime, because then he'll hold it as long as he can until finally he just can't hold it, and he goes wherever he is standing. So, after the poop outside, maybe play a favorite game for a while.
Dogs give some kind of sign that they're going to go, so keep a good eye, and learn his signal. Dakota gets a different walk, I can tell about 30 seconds before she's going to poop. She doesn't really do anything, per se, but something about her is just different, if that makes sense. The way she walks, the way she moves, etc. changes.
What do you do after he poops in the house, and you find it?
bbroyles - I try. we're all learning so all I can do is laugh sometimes. :)
Kevin - after he poops in the house, he comes to us like "uh, I did it again. Yes, I'm fully aware that I'm not supposed to do it, but I did it." We tell him "no, we don't do that here, dogs go outside" and send him to his bed (not his crate because I don't want to use it for punishment when he's leery of it to begin with). He hangs his head, goes and lays down and all is right with the puppy world again when he wakes up.
It's funny that you say we should take him out and walk around until he goes. The trainer is the one who said 5-10 minutes only, then back into the house, repeat. Apparently the thought is that he gets involved with other things and forgets that it's not playtime. If he's out for short spurts that are specifically in his potty area, he'll get conditioned to go there and if he doesn't go then back into the house.
You're right about us taking him out whenever and that it's conditioning him, which is what I don't want to do, but each time we hope that we'll catch him before we have to clean it up again.
This dog would be great at poker though, he has no poop tell!! Seriously, when he does start to go in the house and we catch him, he's walking around like normal and then he just stops and goes.
Didn't you say in your introduction that he was kept in a pen outside for 12-14 hours a day before you got him? He never learned it's not OK to soil where he lives then, he really didn't have a choice. So you have that hurdle to overcome. When you have him outside, I wouldn't let him get too distracted digging holes and the such, he's out there to do his business. Frankly, coming from his background, he must feel like he's in heaven with the positive attention he's getting, and he is eager to take it all in and learn learn learn. I'm curious, does he "go" in the same spot or two in the house, or is it just random?
He was crated inside for 12-14 hours a day, yet he doesn't soil his crate. When he goes, it's actually quite random where it happens. So we're able to keep an eye on him, I've blocked off the spare bedroom and office which are right off of the main living area. The upstairs door is closed, as is the one leading downstairs to the door.
If he can get by the blockade to the office, he goes in there. If he can get upstairs, he goes in the back bedroom. Mainly though, he drops as he's walking through the kitchen & living room as that's about the only places he can go.
I'm thinking it was a crate that Gauge was confined to for such long periods in his first home... I was a bit reluctant to suggest what I did because of that. But it's a teaching method, especially if he doesn't have the habit of going in the crate. I'm glad to read that he is starting to view his crate as his den and safe, quiet place. Sounds like you are making important progress there. With Gauge's history of so much time in the crate, that could have been a major retraining problem.
It seems like he is making good progress. He's going to need time and consistency to be successful with the rules. Remember how long he was unguided. Keep supporting everything he learns... Parties & Parades :)
I would put his crate right by the door you exit for potty breaks. Open crate door, get leash on and go. Dobes are pretty quick to transfer learning something to a new situation:)
Are you familiar with marking behaviors? Is it possible that your dog thinks he's getting in trouble for pooping, but not necessarily for pooping in the house? That's a fine line, and if you say he has pooped just a few times outside with you, and when he does it in the house he walks away to be alone, it sounds to me like he's scared to poop in front of you. Maybe the previous owners beat him for pooping in the house, or maybe your accidentally marking the poop behavior, and he thinks it's bad for him to poop?
Kevin, it's altogether possible. We're finding a lot of things they said about his temperament, training and the like aren't 100% true. I know there's an adjustment period, but some of the basic things not even related to potty traiing shouldn't have fallen out of his brain when he left their house.
When he does go outside with us, he finishes and runs right to our side, knowing he gets his treats and belly rubs. He's leashed because he can't just run outside right now without boundaries. He won't come when called so he's leashed whenever he steps foot out of the house.
Broyles - cage is in our bedroom and it needs to stay there so he'll sleep in it at night. Eventually, we'll be able to move, but at this moment, he's not 100% sure that he knows it's his safe place.
Thanks for the input, any and all is helpful.
Neither Cisco nor Raven liked to be watched when they go. They also will not go on the leash unless it is an absolute emergency- (ie - we are on a long walk and they can't hold it anymore)
I agree with Kevin and every one else as well...
You do need to take him out and leave him out til he goes... plain and simple. And when he does- PRAISE! I know it sucks sometimes to have to stand out there for an hour but if that is what it takes- i think it is better than the in/out thing.
Just a random suggestion... maybe he doesnt like your designated potty spot for poo... Cisco has a pee area and a totally different poop area. Raven just sniffs til she finds a place to her liking.
Since you can't let him off leash - Maybe go and get a longer training line and then he will feel more free and be able to find a place he deems potty worthy....
Thanks again for the input.
We've done ok the past couple of days, but I've also been home to watch him closely. As for the designated place to poo, it's funny because I've been walking him all over the yard and he doesn't go until we're back in the "potty yard".
Cisco, we have a 33' line in the back yard, but when he's on that, it's playtime. We lay down and play with the bugs that land on us, run around the tree, chase our tail, make mom and dad unwind us 39 times and then go when we're back on the leash and on the potty yard.
So, we're getting there. I've been trying to watch his walk, his moves, his "tell" but there really isn't anything I'm picking up on yet. We'll keep at it!
I am not proud to admit this, but I may have shed a few tears this morning. I'm getting to know the tell for him to do the business outside, but it's sporadic. Mornings are an absolute .000 average. We can get up and walk him outside for 20 minutes. He'll crap 5 minutes after we come in. Walk him the next day for 25 minutes. 5 minutes after we're in? Poo. 30 minutes? Same story. I walked him for an hour this morning and nothing. Came in, got in the shower and smelled the present the second I turned the water off.
I know he doesn't get why I was so upset, because it was a good 10 minutes after he did it. Sigh. We'll keep at it and hope that it starts to click. Even with our schedules being different in the morning (husband is a firefighter so he's gone early every 3rd day), we've tried to keep it relatively routine in the a.m. Get up, go outside (where Gauge only pees), walk around (stare off into distance, think about where we're going to poop when we get back inside), come in, eat breakfast, shower, etc. Without fail, the second one of us gets into the shower, he goes.
The rest of the time, we're doing better. Watching closely. We're about 80% there and trying to not run outside every time he's by the door.
Days go by. Frustrations mount. Then he does what he's supposed to do and he gets a parade. Then the next morning we have a present on the floor.
Grrrr.
I'm going to suggest something that is totally frowned on, but I was forced to resort to this method. Within days of my getting Fancy at 8 weeks old, my neighbor's dogs started digging under the fence and coming into my back yard. They had parvo in their yard the year before so I didn't take any chances! I have a fenced patio before you get all the way out back, but the rungs are far enough apart that she could get through them. Of course I couldn't let the min pin out either as he can get over under etc. My husband put up temporary mobile home skirting material to block it. After that I could at least put her on the porch, but bleached it everyday. What I had to do was get puppy pads and put them down in her favorite "potty" places in the house, eventually getting them only to right inside the patio door. When she completed her shots and could go outside, I put the training pads outside, took her out frequently, etc. as in housebreaking. (They have an odor on them that attracts the dogs). She would go on them, or at least get the idea that it was ok to potty there. Like you said, a parade in their honor ensues. If you have to take out a soiled one and put it in the area where you want him to go, that may help. Fancy still to this day will occasionally poop on the same spot on the patio, but it's no big deal, scoop and spray off, done. (Actually it's easier than digging it out of the river rocks in the flower beds LOL) I know I'm going to get flack for this as most trainers don't like puppy pads at all, but it's a suggestion and a possible solution to an unconventional problem. Good luck, and no more tears! He'll get there.
Before got her vaccines I didn't let my puppy out, so she learnt that the place for potty is on the balcony. When time come to start to go potty outside, she was confused and thought that she must go on the balcony. So, we would walk outside and after we would come inside she would poop or pee on the balcony. Some times she would pee in front of the door, just before we go out - she thought that she was supposed to do it inside and than go for a walk.
After few frustrating weeks of doing it, somehow she realized that it is OK to go potty outside, and now she doesn't mind - if she is in the house she would go on the balcony - which I'm trying to prevent with taking her out. But she knows that I prefer for her to go outside.
I think your situation is similar. Please, continue with patience, and believe me I know how frustrating it can be. I cry quite a lot too - only because od her. 
Your puppy is confused, but I believe he will learn what to do, very soon.
You can try the advice of Happydance, whatever it takes for your baby.
Waiting for good news from you.
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Tans ~ "We'll go outside, he'll sniff and then chase bugs, dig a hole, stare off into the distance, contemplate life, etc."
You've a great humor about it!
If he doesn't go in crate, you might try crating after feeding. He may nap on full tummy and ask to be let out on waking and maybe timing will be perfect! Once you get some successes going, he'll probably catch on fast! I've also read that you should not let a dog see you clean up after them.