Teaching come
Our pup Griswold is almost 7 months old. He is very smart and learns very fast. He knows sit,stay, down, leave it, shake, working on heel etc. The one command we really need him to learn though is COME! We have been working in the backyard on a long leash using treats he will do it but thats it. There have been instances when he gets out in the neigborhood and we can't get him to COME to us. We usually have to chase him or use treats. What are some suggestions on teaching him this? I have been told by his puppy class trainer it is one of the hardest commands to get...what age is reasonable for us to expect him to get it and come when called even without treats?
Loved the answer Kevin gave you. It is the hardest command to train but be consistent and do not repeat yourself 50 times with "Griswold, Come, come come COME!" you will lose the word as a command as it becomes background noise. Make sure when you say come you know they are going to succeed.
I agree with Kevin is well, our puppy Athena is 12 weeks old today and knows come pretty well. Ya have to make sure that her full attention is on you and if it's not then forget it because their minds are on everything else. I started of with treats too, and then began to ween them off of it just so she doesn't think she is getting something everytime. Don't get me wrong though she has her bad days where she won't listen to a single command, but you just have to stick with it because they do get it.
Another good tool we use is a restrained recall. One person hold the dogs leash is boring (just an anchor) the other person gets the dog very excited with treats or a toy or just themselves. Then you run away from the dog 20-30 feet or more after some practice. Turn around and give the come command, as soon as you say come the other person drops the leash. When the dog comes make the biggest deal you possibly can, as soon as they start towards you...good girl good girl, smile, clap whatever but make your dog think she is the coolest girl in the world for coming to you. When she gets there..Jackpot!!!!
Deeks and I have just started training and the recall was the first week ( we are now in our 2nd week). We are not in a class but one-on-one with a trainer. The trainer has 2 rules that I will share. I do not know good they work...time will tell.
1st - always smile in training sessions and never get frustrated. Think of something pleasant if you start to lose patience with your dog.
2nd - For the recall, never call your dog to come if you cannot reel him in. Period. This of course is only until he is reliable on the recall. If he is good in the yard but not other places then I would work him in other places. If he can be distracted somewhere that is a teachable moment. When he is distracted, give the come command one time and if he does not respond..reel him in and give tons of encouragement as you are reeling him in. Even more when he gets there.
I have gotten to the point where I NEED to have distractions because Deeks anticipates the come command and keeps me in his periferal vision. If I start to turn he turns and follows. If I stop he stops and waits.
I am sure we will have our moments of not coming as he is only 10 weeks old but he has a good foundation started for the future. The trainer suggested having him drag the lead around the house since he anticipates the recall and then when he is distracted, pick him up and call him in. The only problem is that he picks it up and follows me! So that is not working. He does get the occasional treat as a reward but I believe that Kevin hit it on the head...he much prefers my approval and praise. We always end our short sessions with a play session.
Hope this helps.
oooops...should have proofed before publishing...spelling not so great. Sorry
Thank you in advance for considering this rather long post. Your comments would be appreciated. For circumstancial reasons, my obedience training with Koda started rather late. I got him at 4 months but have only really started obedience training more recently at about 10 months. He got through the sit, down, stay(short distance) commands rather quickly. We did spent more time walking on leash which he does very well. I have also run him a lot! This was purposefully done for good reason. He is now 11 months old and I am trying hard to teach him down/stay/come commands. Recall is about 15%-20%. He's good for up to 30meters with 'sit/stay/COME!' command with no distractions after which he wants to follow.
We practice this on a narrow abandonned concrete jetty (about 100meters) on the edge of an ocean strip. Access is only from one side. We walk to the end and I tell him to stay. He can't turn around and walk away and he's not interested in jumping in the water. So his only exit path is past me and naturally he does not get very far without me returning him to the original spot where I told him to stay. We spend about 15-20minutes doing the 'sit/down/stay/come' command for up to about 30 meters. Sometimes the 100meters goes very quickly and other times it's like we have just started the training routine.I do this particular training 3 to 4 times per week. This is apart from his running and swimming in the sea playing fetch with a frizbe which he enjoys very much. He is very active and I believe leads a balanced family life around 4 kids. I would like him to socialise and play more with other dogs, other than a medium size street dog we have who's now about a 1/4 of his size. He does play with some other dogs off leash for about 20 minutes once or twice per week on the beach, but I have to say it makes me nervous as dogs like him have been poorly branded as viscious ruthless savages on this small island where we live. So one needs to be extremely careful that NOTHING bad happens. How I abhore stupidity and complete ignorance!
My concern is about at what stage I could expect to be in the position to work with him off leash. At what age could I expect that maybe someday I can take him to the beach and have him off leash. Do you think this could be a possibility? When does off leash training begin? Is there still hope that his recall will improve...uh...when I say come, I am not issuing a 'come play catch' command! lol
And by the way, he is such a lovely Dobe with such a gorgeous, playful temperament- a bit stubborn at times, but beautiful nevertheless.
Thanks for your consideration.
I needed that!
@ charlenecm: Thanks for sharing.
Thanks also for the 2 rules your trainer gave you- noted.
You say you NEED distractions. I don't quite understand why you say, "you NEED to have distractions." Clarrification would be appreciated. Certainly, that's what I think I don't need. I want Koda's full attention, especially because I don't have one of those 'reel in' leashes. I will try to find one in our village, but I think they are rather scarce.
FYI :The problem is if I try off leash on our local beach our local community would be up in arms with me for allowing a "savage beast" like Koda roam free. (yet all their dogs roam freely)
I have cut back on the treats because like you said, Koda much prefers approval and praise.
@ Control_Freak: Thanks for sharing.
I think that's a great idea. I am gonna try that just as soon as I have finished on the computer.
:)
Distractions are anything that would bring his attention off you. If you only train in your private back yard with only you, the likelyhood of him listening is high because there's nothing else around. A distraction could be anything from another person just strolling around while you train to that person shaking something that makes noise that would cause him to look up at them or it. If he's looking at them and you call him and he comes, you have beaten a distraction. Maybe it's another dog in the yard, that he has to ignore and listen to you instead. Maybe it's a cat....literlly anything that to them would be more interesting than you is a distraction. They need to learn that no matter what else is around or happening if you say come they MUST come.
Many of us live in developments or near streets...so think of it like this. if he were loose in the front yard and someone with a dog was on the other side of the street and a car was coming would he stop and come back if you told him too? If you aren't sure about that answer then he's not ready to be off-leash. It's as much about his safety as the safety of others, it's scary when a strange dog runs up to you.
So when you start doing this kind of training, would one start in an area with no distractions first?
from Jagabags: So when you start doing this kind of training, would one start in an area with no distractions first?
That would be your best bet. Slowly add small distractions but keep practicing the come command. Dont move on to major distractions (kids playing next door, cat across the street, etc) until you have a reliable 'come', and even then, expect your dog to break his attention at first. Never set your dog up to fail----always make sure you're training him for a positive ending.
Exactly - start with no distractions like the quiet confines of your back yard and once your confident he has that...maybe do it when a neighbor is outside or there's something going on that's different. Add people - add noise, all one at a time and keep him on a long lead so if during any of those moments he is distracted you can give a little tug and make him.
Some people train solely off positive reinforcement and if that works great. I don't punish Rocky but if he doesn't do what I ask he's forced to. If I say Sit and he doesn't the next time I say it I'm pushing his butt to the ground. I feel that if I jsut stand there repeating it until he decided to do it, then it's not that he's trained he just decided to finally do what I asked. Same with 'come' if I call him he better come if I have to repeat it once he gets pulled to me.
once you go a few weeks in the back yard with distractions take him to a park or something with strangers around and again with a long lead - do your training there.
Thanks Lori and Ziva's dad.
I must say, I am of the opinion that dominant breeds like Dobermanns need strong leadership. They are as I understand century dogs and should do exactly what you tell them in no uncertain terms. Sure they need to be trained to do what you want and they will excell. Koda is a male. He can be as stubborn ...mmm...as me I guess....uh a male thing - we are animals first.lol But when we are walking, something may trigger this stubborness and he'll just stop. I try to coax him on, but he won't budge. It is then then that I yank him forward and almost growl, "COME!" and he does. I really think it's sometimes a battle of the will, him showing his determination, him trying to show HE IS DOMINANT! And I will not tolerate him challenging me, you see. I am the alpha male in our household as far as he's concernd.(and my wife wears the pants! lol) I really think that he's deliberately challenging me at time and I understand it. My kids sometimes do that and I guess he's just like them sometimes. Getting back to the point, I do try to praise him EVERY time he comes to me even if it's on his own accord. Strangly enough when I say, "come," it's when I say it with my arms at my side and my right hand open, that he listens and showns more interest in coming to me. There are times though when I can stand on my head and blow bubbles out my...mmm...ears and he totally ignores me. But that's ok, I love him to bits all the same!
Does anyone have a male and do you find they can be very stubborn?
It's called the Doberteens. Be consistant and hang in there! byw, it's not just a "male" thing. My girl is pretty laid back, but she still "tests" me. Fasten your seal belt. Just be sure to end every training session on a postive note, even if you have to regress to something that he knows and does without question.
from Jagabags: I must say, I am of the opinion that dominant breeds like Dobermanns need strong leadership.
MOST DEFINITELY!!!!
I did the exactly same with Rocky...a nice tug on the leash and strong voice does wonders for listening. I let Rocky run loose usually a few times a week in a huge field by a pond near the house so it's important for me that he come when called. Tye actually laughs now because he finally figured out why Rocky will often just walk up to me on our walks even though I haven't called him. He wondered why he stayed so much closer to me than to him when he takes him out. I finally let him in on my secret - I carry biscuits on all walks...and most every time he comes to me whether called or not he gets a little piece of one as he walks by from my hand. It helps keep him close and he learned early that coming to me is rewarding.
If at any time he doesn't come to me and I have to take a step toward him or call repeatedly - he is then leashed for the rest of the walk too. He's a smart little bugger though...if he really doesn't want to come he will just walk slowly to me rather than run over like usual. I guess it's his little bit of rebellion...:)

Pet Profiles
I think the best way to have a reliable recall is to make yourself more fun than any other thing in the world. Right now, exploring the neighborhood or whatever distractions are around is more fun than coming back when called. I make a BIG deal out of recalls, every single time, doesn't matter what the situation is. I also find a great way to train is to mark behaviors that your dog does naturally, when they do them. For instance, if your dog comes over to you, even without being called, make a big deal out of it. When your dog listens to a recall, make an even bigger deal out of it. When we train, and are doing recall work, I use my dogs FAVORITE things in the world as rewards. Tug, chasing something, (high prey drive) running around in the yard with me, I vary it up and keep it fun and interesting. If you can make yourself more fun than anything else, then there's zero reason not to come when called.
What training methods do you prefer to use?