SearchAdvise on Breeders?
Hello Everyone! I live in upstate NY and am planning on getting my first Doberman in the spring. I have been reading everything I can about Dobermans and have literally read this entire site, which helped me understand the importance of finding a good breeder. They are much more expensive than I had hoped, but I suppose it’s a necessary evil. Provided that they have pups in the spring I am currently looking at the following three breeders and was wondering if anyone had any extra information on them? Also, I am willing to drive a considerable distance and if anyone knows of any other breeders that they recommend I would love to hear about it. I’m not planning on showing or breeding the dog, just raising it as a family member and pet. :)
http://highcountrydobermans.webs.com/
Please keep in mind that my finances are limited, my absolute upper limit is about $2000 after ear crop. Thanks for your input and if you have any questions feel free to ask!
I think Fitzmar gave you the best advice... keep doing your research. Your relationship with your breeder should be a good one... mine still contacts me if I don't update every now and then on how Steve is doing.. and they are your first resource for questions and problems that may come up as the dog grows.
I live literally 30 minutes from wilorun and was going to get a female from here this past spring- But Raven needed me more and I saved her instead!
I know of a few people who really like Nancy- My vet tech has a male from her.
She doesn't list her health-testing on the site- but will give you all the dam and sire's health testing results when asked.
She is a nice lady and very knowledgeable about the breed.
But I agree with fitzmar and Jesh - keep on researching and find the right breeder for you.
I was going to say the exact thing that Fitzmar said to you! :) We have such smart people in this community which you'll find to be very helpful. Remember having a doberman is a commitment and make sure your financially stable. (cost of dog, ears and tail being done, vaccinations, health upkeep, food, spaying or neutering and all other doggie supplies) I read some where on average a good well breded doberman will cost between $800-1000. Could be more or less, so your price seems fair. Good Luck :)
Thanks for the advise! I have looked at pretty much every breeder within about 300 miles with a website and the cheapest I have found after the ear crop has been about $1800. I know that there are many good breeders without websites but it's hard to know what they are all about. Dog shows seem like a good idea and I will definitely look into it. Is there a website on where all the dog shows are? Cisco, I'm happy to hear that you know of Nancy and I will definitely keep her in mind when the time comes.
I don't know for sure, but I imagine that the AKC website might be a place to start to find shows.
Yes, on this part of the AKC website, you can do a search by state for upcoming shows.
a lot of the shows in our area (PA, NJ, NY) can be found on info dog as well - or RAU, but infodog has the best website.
www.infodog.com about a week before a show, the entry and the ring time will be posted - you want to make sure that you don't miss Dobermans - they are often very early.
Thanks everyone for your advise! I'm working on finding a dog show that will work with my schedule. In addition, this weekend I'll be visiting AVO Dobermans in Lockport, NY to meet his dogs and ask some questions! Any advise anyone has is always welcome! :)
Here is a listing of upcoming shows in NY state: http://www.infodog.com/panels/ny.htm
You are looking for AB (All breed) shows - they can also have obedience/Rally/Jr showmanship at them also. Looks like there are some coming up the weekend of the 17th. This weekend there are shows in North Jersey here:
http://www.infodog.com/panels/nj.htm
This weekend in NJ - Saturday there will be over 30 Dobermans showing at 10am in ring four at this show:
http://www.infodog.com/jps/249/jpg249.pdf
I'm not showing this weekend - but will be at shows the following weekend in PA - Lehigh KC and Berks KC in Macungie PA. They are major entries in Dobermans so there will be plenty to look at.
If your a novice dog owner, I will suggest you stay away from the Euro bred dogs. They are notoriously more demanding and their activity levels generally speaking is very high. I would suggest an American bred dog for their ability to settle down quickier and be much less demanding. I base my opinions on training Dobermanns for over 45 years and owning the original German bred dogs and then the American lines and now a Euro bred dog. I would be very cautious about anyone mixing these lines unless they are top notch breeders who train their own dogs and exhibit them. Mixing the lines without researching the temperaments and understanding character can develop terrible flaws such as instability and possessiveness. I've seen this alot in the past ten years and have dealt with this problem all to often. There are alot of byb'ers buying Euro dogs and breeding them to bybred American lines and if those strong willed dogs happen to be bred to dogs with weak characters you have serious issues as I mentioned. Take your time and a helpfull hint is that most breeders will not own their own stud dog. Responsible breeders may co-own a stud but 8 out of 10 times bring their bitch to a stud. Almost ALL byb'ers will have the stud with them, its just an easy way of eliminating a stud fee and often these so-called breeders know nothing about the Standard (structure & temperament) of the Dobermann. The Standard is simply the "Blue Print" that describes the breeds looks and actions. If you ask a breeder about the Standard and they know nothing of it or dismiss it.......RUN!! If they don't agree with a proven blue print and they think that their concept is better, their fools. Go on to next one. Von
Best of luck finding your new son/daughter! :) Only thing I really would suggest is talk to the breeder and make sure they will be there for you non-stop. Maybe ask for references even...
One thing I wish I had was more communication with my breeder.
Thanks for all the advise everyone! This past weekend my girlfriend and I met with the breeder who runs AVO dobermans. We met the parents of our possible puppy and I got to ask the breeder as many questions as I wanted. His responses were all appropriate and what I would expect from a good breeder. His dogs were all well behaved and friendly. I'm pretty sure that we will be getting pups from him in the spring and I can't wait! :) The breeder keeps contact with many of the people that he has sold a pup to and said that I could contact them if I wanted. Feel free to let me know anymore advise!
Ask yourself a question - what does this breeder do beyond breed? I don't see a single title on any of their dogs. I'm glad they are health testing - Kudo's to them for that. However, there is more to it than what they are doing. JMHO
Have you considered going to any shows? Don't be in a rush to commit to a litter.
I am considering going to the show this coming Saturday in Lockport, NY. I think it is hosted by Kennel Club of Niagara Falls. The event number is 2011039901. Is this the type of show I should go to?
I have not yet put a down payment to reserve a puppy, so I am more than willing to check out more breeders. I just don't know really anything about what type of shows to go to...
SXk, I just looked at the three sites you requested some feed back from and their all very poor in quality and the pedigrees explain why they are. When I tell folks that certain so-called breeders are breeding "pet" quality dogs they figure its ok because their looking for a pet, Right??? Wrong!! What you want is a dog bred with the correct structure so their bodies are strong and won't experience problems in their lives with hips failing or top lines faultering so the dog can't move properly. Breeding quality has nothing to do with showing dogs and showing dogs has little to nothing to do with breeding quality. Your right its not eay buying a good dog but its real easy to by a pet that has little to no quality bred into it.
SXk, Did this breeder demo a good OB exercise for you? How about a demo showing their protectiveness of their house? Having a friendly disposition with strangers is fine and a good dog that does protect always has that feature but did they exhibit the dogs protective side?
In my opinion there were NO dogs worthy of being bred on any of the three sites I looked at. The pedigrees were terrible using Russian lines that have questionable health status coupled with Kimbertal lines that have no semblance of any effort to correct flaws in conformation or temperaments. This company breeds to produce pups for earnings, nothing to do with quality.
I will agree that going to the shows is a good idea because you get to see more Dobermanns and get more information so your opinion of the breed isn't just on looks. How the dogs react is very important and ask the breeders if they health test for physical issues and test for character flaws too. Please take your time and talk to more people, the AVO folks I'm sure are nice but their dogs are pet quality that means theres much better dogs out there to be bred, and their dogs conformation wise shouldn't be. Thats my opinion and its based on my years of experience with the breed. Von
I don't know about the second two breeders, but Avortman used to be a member on this forum and has several informative posts in the breeder and puppy section back in 2007 and 2008. At least their website is up to date, and they limit the number of litters, raise them in the house and do the health testing.
I do not know about the prices, but before I was fortunate to get Princess (her litter is listed in that same area in that time frame) so never followed up with them. I would trust them unless I received information to the contrary.
Rgreen4, thanks I was actually able to search for him and find the forums that he was active in and read the conversations that he has had. He was actually very active for a while but the newest posts I could find were back in 2009. While active he seemed very knowledgeable.
Von, when I was at AVO it was obvious that the male, Gunnar, was protective of the house and very alert. How should a dog react when being introduced? I really don't know how to read a pedigree, of the females on the AVO site which do you think is better? I do know that AVO does extensive health testing which is good.
Fitzmar, while looking for breeders I ended up on your website and recognized the name! Harvard is an absolutely beautiful dog! :)
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You can do better. For $2000 you can get a nice puppy from a very reputable breeder - parents will be health tested and most likely champions, ears will be done, and breeder support would be excellent.
Go to www.dpca.org and there is a breeder list. Not every breeder on there is wonderful - you have to do your homework. I would also suggest going to dog shows to see the dogs and meet breeders and owners. Find a breeder you like and get on their list. Just remember that truly reputable breeders are picky about where their puppies go